Comments on: Mickey Mouse degrees are just the job

By: MarkE

MarkE — Thu, 06 Sep 2007 11:45:26 +0000

Lee Jakeman

Education has always been a problem for economists because it is hard to define the market. Is it the future employer of graduates, the students or the parents of students?

British universities are trying to appeal to prospective students as their market, but those students may not be equipped to choose between courses; they have been told (wrongly) that they should choose less rigorous A level subjects in order to get better grades and they now believe the same applies to their choice of degree subject. I am told there are many students who are leaving university with “good” degrees in some subjects who are finding themselves earning no more than their former classmates who went into the workplace after A levels, except the graduates have their student debt to worry about (which might make them more motivated I suppose).

I will declare an interest as my daughter is taking my advice to take a scientific degree. I believe she will find the course and subsequent career intellectually rewarding, but if she wants financial rewards and social respect she will need to leave the UK for a developed country.

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By: Lee Jakeman

Lee Jakeman — Wed, 05 Sep 2007 03:19:57 +0000

I think there is a flaw in this article about “Mickey Mouse” degrees. I agree that it’s a case of “supply and demand”, with the market largely defining what skills are needed – the demand side – and the universities responding by providing appropriate courses – the supply side. The problem is that our left-wing universities couldn’t give two hoots about the market. Course content has more to do with their prevailing ideology than it has to do with any market considerations. If the universities themselves were driven by the same market considerations when developing courses, the system might just work.

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By: Rebecca

Rebecca — Mon, 03 Sep 2007 22:48:38 +0000

Hi, as a proud owner of one of the apparently worthless degrees from one of thos ex technical colleges I was outraged by this article! I achieved a First Class Honours Mathematics degree and am currently working in an investment bank in the city, in fact I’ve worked for FTSE 100 companies since I left uni 7 years ago. I can guarantee you that I have excelled in the workplace and exceeded many of my peers from other ‘red brick’, Boris approved universities. I was a supporter of Boris but I think this shows him for what he is. As a higher rate tax payer and resident in London I will not be voting for him. Perhaps we can find a Mayor for London who cares about people and not just in making outlandish statements to create some column inches!

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By: MJ

MJ — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 23:25:37 +0000

Yes, yes we do need more people that can fix sceptic tank, do the pipes, wire up houses and what not, but no they should not be taken from the people who wish to better themsevles with education, but perhaps a use could be given to those members of “upperclass” who seem to have no skills, trades or indeed use at all.

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By: crystal cobweb

crystal cobweb — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 13:55:13 +0000

“The fact is we have always treated all men who stand on our shores as equal before the law.” (Stephen L)

I take your point and nicely put. (Pity I wasn’t able to print the above in italics, though.)

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By: Andrew Milner

Andrew Milner — Thu, 30 Aug 2007 06:08:35 +0000

Sounds as if a degree certificate from The University of Life (Khao San Road, Bangkok) could be more significant than one from a British university in some “Mickey Mouse” discipline. After all, you have to get yourself into Asia, decide the details you want on the certificate and the institute of higher learning you favoured with your mythical presence. Try to avoid changing your date of birth if at all possible. And obviously make sure you don’t get the graduation day on a Sunday or public holiday. Quite a lot of planning. And face it, once you made the “City of Angels (fallen angels some might quip), there are so many places in the region you’ll want to check out before heading back to banal UK: Laos, Cambodia, Myanmar (Burma in BBC speak), Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia, Singapore, China, Nepal, Sri Lanka, India, Bangladesh, Tibet, Mongolia (perhaps not)… with the Philippines, Korea, Taiwan and Indonesia only a hop, skip and a jump on budget priced airlines. And then at last, the prize: Japan. Cue “Sakura” music on koto. Sounds like a real education. Oriental Fine Arts, perhaps? Or better yet, “Business Studies: Seek Your Fortune in the Colonies”. So if you ever find yourselves in downtown ….

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By: Steven_L

Steven_L — Wed, 29 Aug 2007 23:09:39 +0000

< “Well… England played a big part in supporting apartheid in South Africa. And that was so, so wrong. But I agree with what you say about Ken Livingstone’s political manipulations.” (crystal cobweb)<

Italy supported Hitler. Should we hold it against them today? The fact is we have always treated all men who stand on our shores as equal before the law.

Livingstone still supports the Chavez regime without any criticism of his totalitarian stance (i.e. unions saying to workers support Chavez of leave) towards freedom of conscience.

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By: crystal cobweb

crystal cobweb — Wed, 29 Aug 2007 22:20:45 +0000

“The nauseating sight of Ken’s blub-fest” (PaulD)

Facile emotionalism – yes, I think Ken Livingstone is good at that. But I wonder if the Ken Livingstone Amateur Dramatics Club will tire even left-wingers who are perhaps getting a mite cynical about his ability to play the race-card at the drop of a hat.

The problem with the Left is that it’s a choice either between the New Labour Thatcherites or the Ken Livingstone Trotskyist contingent, who are actually quite ready to launch a smear-campaign even when a lot less is at stake than the Mayorship. A democratic exchange of views or opinions with them? Forget it.

“OK for some it seems, but I can’t see the Tories making it any better, they’re already pandering to the mega-rich!” (Joe Bloggs)

I agree – but so do New Labour. They seem to be even more guilty of it than the Tories at the moment because they’re the ones in power. Is there any party out there that actually represents the ordinary majority?

“We are not, and never have been an apartheid nation” (Stephen L)

Well… England played a big part in supporting apartheid in South Africa. And that was so, so wrong. But I agree with what you say about Ken Livingstone’s political manipulations.

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By: tellitasitis

tellitasitis — Wed, 29 Aug 2007 21:59:16 +0000

Steven L…..We are not,and never have been an Apartheid nation. we do not and never have had a two tier system of civil rights, No police station in the UK has ever had a separate door marked “Coloured”.

No, but there are NuLab government department doors marked “No White English”, the Anglian Region’s Agency flood managment programme door for starters, remember Abigail Howarth, she is probably not the only victim.

Apartheid is alive and well in England, and the indigenous Anglo-Saxons are the fall guys and gals.

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By: homo escapeons

homo escapeons — Wed, 29 Aug 2007 20:13:22 +0000

My entire working knowledge of the British Educational System has been gleaned from numerous viewings of Monty Python’s The Meaning of Life. This would seem to immediately disqualify me from offering anything constructive but certain universal truths exist.

There are those who pursue higher education and simply learn how to memorise random bits of trivia, data, or information until they pass an examination and pay the erstwhile nerds in full for the cheat sheets.

A few lucky bastards actually learn how to think but far too many students should be sponsored by NASA and become Astronauts because they are taking up space.

Like most people I have met professional students with more degrees than a thermometer who do not have a lick of common sense but luckily most of them are steered out of our way and vanish into careers in Government.

I firmly believe that it cannot hurt even the daftest twit to be exposed to radical Marxist-Feminist doctrines on their way to becoming a Veterinarian or Phys Ed Teacher.

Analyzing different points of view will help most graduating/unemployable Engineers, Lawyers, Accountants and Economists better understand the needs of their illiterate, frustrated, customers at WalMart. Manipulating them and invoking their primal, insatiable, appetite to overspend should be a Pavlovian ‘walk-in-the-park.

Last night I watched America at a Crossroads and I thoroughly enjoyed your explanation of why Brits have a secret pride of ownership regarding America. As a Canadian I am forced to endure a cultural tug of war between the Elephant to the South and the Motherland. These days the relationship between our ‘psychological’ Parents seems far more complex than Shaw’s remark about being separated by a common language.

In lieu of forging a unique National Identity through a National Education Program Canada’s main response to offsetting American assimilation by osmosis seems to be limited to sending Comedians to Hollywood, and providing les Quebecois with a local platform from which to voice the indignation and universal disdain of the Anglische that France imported to the New World some 400 years ago.

Yes here in the Colonies we cope as best we can by renewing our subscription to Majesty magazine and by watching reruns of American Idol and Coronation Street instead of studying for exams.

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