Control the Room

-Bush said that the alleged plot to bomb al Jazeera’s international headquarters was an “outlandish” accusation/
We’ll never know the truth until the Official Secrets Act is defied by a British official or a news organization/
We will know/
when someone has the guts to publish the 5 page memo/
To cover their own actions which were reprehensible/
Rumsfeld said that what al Jazeera was doing was vicious, inaccurate and inexcusable/
Rumsfeld never made a reference to what the U.S. had done/
Bombing al Jazeera’s offices in Afghanistan in 2001/
‘Vicious’ and ‘inexcusable’ was our government/
when U.S. forces killed Tareq Agoub, al Jazeera’s Baghdad correspondent/

So that’s a snippet.It’s about 3 minutes long and I’ll gladly type and send the whole thing to anyone that tells me they dug it.Peace

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Suffice to say , I disagree with your standpoint, however expressed , but willl defend your right to hold them.( Not very original ,I agree, but well meant , nevertheless).

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Terms of reference:

Governance:
The right to participate in and make decisions with regard to a nation’s affairs, which is critical in democratising the state and society. Characteristics of good governance include: political accountability, freedom of association and participation, a sound judicial system, bureaucratic accountability, freedom of information and expression as well as capacity building. All these aspects are essential to sustainable development.
http://www.polity.org.za/html/govdocs/white_papers/social97gloss.html

The management of a system, usually political or organisational, involving mutual adjustment, negotiation and accommodation between the parties involved rather than direct control.
http://www.booksites.net/download/chadwickbeech/Glossary.htm

The exercise of political, economic, and administrative authority in the management of a country’s affairs at all levels. It is a neutral concept comprising the complex mechanisms, processes, relationships and institutions through which citizens and groups articulate their interests, exercise their rights and obligations and mediate their differences. (UNDP definition)
http://www.emro.who.int/mei/mep/Healthsystemsglossary.htm

N.B. Governance deals with the processes and systems by which an organization or society operate. Frequently a government is established to administer these processes and systems.

Modality:

Semiotics referring to the status of reality ascribed to, and or claimed by a sign (i.e. by Governance)

Debate:

A process of inquiry and advocacy seeking reasoned judgement on a proposition. Debate allows for two or more sides advocating their positions on given issues under some set of rules.
http://www.tmsdebate.org/main/forensics/glossary.htm

Now, clarification of terms over with.

Manifestly Chewbacca Defence, ought not to be passed on, as debate. Further, evident acceptance of the unlawful invasion and continuing occupation of Iraq on mere ‘as is’ basis, somehow cannot by any flight of fancy, make ‘as is’ lawful.

Therefore, in dealing with ‘as is’ one obvious course of action is to legislate, passing onto statute, measures that legalise; unprovoked wars, indefinite occupation, mass murder, smash and grab, profiteering, torture, extra judicial detentions, and random shooting of civilians. This course of action solving all of the problems facing ‘as is’, however gives rise to a tinsywinsy trouble of dealing with other powerful nation entities, who may decide to follow suit, and proceed to liberate any and all resource they fancy from anywhere around the globe.

On the other hand, if the illegality of ‘as is’ is taken account of. Then there can be no extenuating circumstances that can make legal the unlawful ‘as is’. That is to say the only sane course of conduct is to roll back the invading forces, and cease and desist from the occupation of Iraq at once. However, there arises problems of recompensing Iraqis, and the nationals of the coalition of the bribed, that is, compensating those directly or indirectly affected by the misapplication of force in Iraq.

Hence, the limbo that we find ourselves in, and enter the spin masters (disinformation merchants) with their natural propensity to unconscious drivel, that have brought about the current state of blaming anyone standing, or for that matter dropping dead, except the culprits.

Nevertheless, upon entertaining this latter course of action, we have absolved those culprits from any and all responsibility, leaving open the probability of the repetition of the Iraq scenario, elsewhere, resulting in mounting cost of wars at home, and those countries falling victim to the aggression arising from ill thought of and ill intentioned policies of these so called war leaders.

Therefore, the only available alternative would remain in immediate withdrawal of the forces from Iraq, and then start of legal proceedings to establish the extent of the responsibility of those whom have patently failed in their duty of care, and discharge of their duties that they have been so handsomely remunerated for.

Now as per post: your ears are open, and your eyes operate within the anticipated parameters of their design, then perhaps you could address the points forwarded without attributing blame onto the villainous homeworkvore (eats homework only) dog!

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The powers that be must deal with what IS , and not with what might have been. The illegal interference in the internal affairs of Iraq remains a fact , and the insurgency problem remains a fact.

You have a certain mind set regarding the situation , no-one denies tou your right to your opinions. Please have the courtesy of allowing others that luxury.

If you are not open to criticism , perhaps this is the wrong forum. A debate is merely an exchange if ideas, is it not?

Your no doubt well meaning , oft repeated,apparently unending argument as to how you see the problem , is not altering the status quo in Iraq,( as indeed , neither are the counter arguments).

You might contribute to the old adage ,” There are none so blind who will not see, nor none so deaf who will not hear”. I do!

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Pushing the Chewbacca Defence envelope a bit too far are you not?

First pedantry, then rhetorical pedantry, finally incoherent drivel, concluding majority of Iraqis want foreign soldiers on Iraqi soil! While hanging on to the fairytale of ‘free elections in Iraq’, discounting that under international laws of occupation there cannot be any imposition of so called elections, by the occupiers in the lands that are occupied!

Pray tell what new insight have you so far contributed, other than regurgitating the orthodoxies that are peddled by the disinformation merchants deployed by the troop of the hairless apes wielding their sticks?

Address the points forwarded, or desist from trolling the Sun, encyclopaedia, etc. in aid of (by now all too apparent to all and sundry) Chewbacca Defence!

A more up to date encyclopaedia for you:

Chewbacca Defense
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chewbacca_Defense

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Firstly : it is generally agreed that the Iraqis in general would prefer the Allied forces to leave.

The problem which rears its head in this context is, the lawful majority which voted for a specific set of rules for the country, is being forcefully and brutally resisted by the minority, which cannot accept their minority status.

You repeatedly make use of the term

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To clarify the evident confusion that has arisen (Tertiary), let us recap on the earlier forwarded propositions. Iraqi nationals, in line with any of their counter parts from around the globe, aspire to rid their lands from any uninvited guest i.e. the invaders. Further, regardless of the current arrangements for governance, and arbitration in Iraq, set up by the occupiers through the use of their local vassals/puppets/sepoy/etc. Majority of Iraqis (more than 80%) wish to see the back of the foreign soldiers, including the imported civilian contractors (spin for mercenaries, who are not bound by any rules or conventions, as evident in the emergent trophy videos aired on the ITV, and elsewhere).

The ludicrous notion of handing back sovereignty to Iraqis, is not washed away, either by the international laws, or by the Iraqis. Sovereignty is not transferable, it was not taken away by the occupiers, only to be handed back. In clarification of this point, recourse to analogy is called for; any burglar stealing another’s goods, cannot steal the title of the stolen goods, too. Since the title of the goods stolen shall remain by the one, whose property has been stolen. Therefore secretary of state for US cannot hand back sovereignty to Iraqis, regardless of the great sounding bite for the benefit of the TV. Iraqi sovereignty was not taken away from Iraqis to begin with, only to be handed back, by such magnanimity on display!

Therefore, regardless of sugar coated facts, including those from encyclopaedias, Iraqis’ imperatives are to end the occupation of their land, then start rebuilding their institution and put in place some sort of arbitration, and governance. Hence, the current torrent of sectarian wars, and religious ascendancy do not change the facts on the ground. This is reflected even in Telegraph articles putting pay to the foreign fighters myth.

Further Sunnite, and or other foreign expressions involved, evidently have lead to the manifest confusion in the semantics they carry, reflected in the bracketed conclusions, which perhaps ought to be clarified:

Sunnite: a member of the branch of Islam that accepts the first four caliphs as rightful successors to Muhammad
http://wordnet.princeton.edu

Note it is the same religion!

Hopefully, these confusions allayed, the debate, can move away from the sermons in the last part, along with the notions of advantageous facts etc.

Since this debate ought not to be considered a game play, and or pastime for those with little to do, and bored with playing dungeons and dragons, and seeking an alternative. The purpose of this debate ought to be investigation with a view to gleaning a better understanding, in the face of woeful inadequacy of the Main Stream Media discharging their duty. Also highlighting the plight of those disposed from what little they had, in Iraq including, suffering further through the unnecessary deaths of their families, friends, neighbours, as well as the needless deaths of youth of the coalition of the bribed, whom could have contributed to their respective societies, and were cut in their prime for the reasons of course chosen by greedy little old hairless apes, who may have difficulties holding onto their water (prostate is all but a rigid addendum), yet surprisingly find it easy to unleash death and destruction on a biblical scale for the sake of their own twisted imperatives.

Ideal world, real world, are both in the minds of those whom are divorced from the actualities, and living alongside with Barbie Doll, and her entourage. World is what we make of it, and as this debate is going on, it is being made, hence the repugnant misanthropy on display ought to be directed at its rightful origin, the hairless apes, bent on spreading their influence through recourse to the only tools they know how to use; a big stick, in fact the bigger the stick the better the stick.

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I’m having a day off for good behaviour.

Take care.

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The Sunnites’ orthodoxy is marked by an emphasis on the views and customs of the majority of the community, as distinguished from the views of peripheral groups. The institution of consensus evolved by the Sunnites allowed them to incorporate various customs and usages that arose through ordinary historical development but that, nevertheless, had no roots in the Qur

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Enough — the original intent of this action was to topple Saddam. That “goal” was achieved 2 years ago.

The scheme never included nation building or building sewers or building roads or fighting unnamed bogeymen.

Call it what you will; cut and run, abandonment, failure — take your pick, but the American people no longer are willing to follow batshit crazy Bush and his lap dog, Poodle Blair, into the flames of hell any longer.
.

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